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Discussion
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Greetings people, this is my first post. A few months ago I began to be interested in astrology. So I joined certain groups on social networks where this topic is debated. In those groups I see students of ancient and modern astrology, where students of traditional astrology always comment that modern astrology is a joke that hinders traditional studies, they believe that this new astrology is about some conspiracy to destroy the ancient teachings that are the unique necessary to predict and analyze accurately. They say uranus, neptune and pluto do not exert any influence, nor do any asteroids, that they are only holograms without any power, they say that the only functional house system is “Whole Signs Houses”. Are these astrologers and students of the traditional teachings telling the truth?
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Traditional/Medieval Astrology vs Modern Astrology?
updated 2 years, 8 months ago
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I’ve found that even when using systems I don’t typically subscribe to, the results are very similar if not the same. All rivers reach the sea.
I personally have taken bits and pieces from a few different schools and approaches, keeping what resonates with and works for me. I see astrology as a tool and not quite as dogmatic as others, so I like my tool box to have techniques that I use with proven success and reliability.
That being said, I definitely fall more into the traditional astrology school of thought. I find modern astrology is more concerned on the psychological ramification of things, which definitely has it’s place and usage. But predictive astrology is where my interest lies and I’ve found Hellenistic and Vedic help me more in that category.
To each their own. I’m kind of surprised you’re encountering such strong unyielding mindsets in the astrological community. Every astrologer I’ve spoken to has been relatively welcoming and open to outside ideas and approaches. Maybe I’ve just gotten lucky in that regard.
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I think you need to find different forums. Yes, some traditional astrologers are quite avid about not using anything at all other than the 7 traditionals. No outers, no asteroids. That’s their choice and is a legitimate form of astrology. I believe it still works so well because of the depth of analysis, as it goes far beyond what modern does. Modern is more like breadth while traditional is much more depth, perhaps. That might not be a great comparison, but it is how it seems to me.
But many traditional astrologers do incorporate the outers (and even some asteroids), but typically not as rulers of signs nor in other specific tools of traditional astrology, just as important planets on their own. That’s what I do. There is an incredible and balanced structure to sign rulership and more, and we just can’t jackhammer the outers into that. For me, that doesn’t make them any less important to use on their own. I can use them and still keep the foundation and its beautiful functions intact.
Even amongst traditional astrologers, “whole sign houses” are not used by all, by any means. There is an understanding that certain house systems are intended for certain types of astrological work. For example, horary uses Regiomantus, nothing else. Whole sign provides perfect clarity for assessing houses because it clarifies the ruler of the house and the planets in it (no two signs in a house or planets in a sign not ruled by the house ruler). But there are many systems that work. Placidus often gets discouraged (and by me too) because it is faulty in some cases. In other cases, it’s just fine and works. And it really was just an accident it became the default on chart calculation sites and apps – it was in no way because it was “the best one”. But there are many house systems, each with their uses, and pros and cons.
As for modern, I think you need to understand some of what happened. Modern did indeed throw out a whole lot of tools that were key to doing in-depth astrology, and even took some steps, in my words, to “dumb it down” as in just the one example of the “Astrological Alphabet” that conflated sign, house and planet into a single when in fact they had very well developed and separate meanings. We are still battling today the fad of that bit of bad and pervasive misinformation. Part of it also was just the loss of material regarding traditional methods. Other systems, like vedic, had no huge break across history where methods were lost, but western did. It has only been more recently that we have recovered much of what was lost, and that is at least in part, what may be fueling the return to traditional methods. I’m sure someone else could shed light on that specific bit of history better than I can.
I have my bias for traditional, so keep that in mind. I started on modern and studied several different approaches within that, and did that for a long time. Then discovered traditional/hellenistic and just had no clue how much I had been missing. There just is far more depth and complexity in traditional methods and understandings (and that’s rather inarguable) and I found it to be startlingly more accurate. Not saying modern can’t be well-used. But in my experience, and I’d say for most who make that move, it’s a rather stunning shift into a far richer tradition and few ever return to modern.
There are many kinds of even just western astrology. And many specialties besides natal, from medical astrology to financial to even weather. My suggestion is to start with traditional/hellenistic, because it will build an incredible foundation. From there, one can always go into modern or any other branch as one wishes, and I think, will do better for the foundation they have.
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No. I am a Medieval astrologer and believe good astrologers come in all shapes and sizes. Personally, I consider modern astrology more as a form of “stellar psychology” than actual astrology. I also don’t think the outers are always relevant, and have never used an asteroid. I’m known for the extreme accuracy of my readings.
Traditional astrology gives very strong results. That’s the only reason I prefer it. I also don’t mind recognizing when things are bad, which traditional astrology is also very good at doing. Ultimately, I feel that whatever kind of astrology “resonates” with the person, they should use. I’ve found what works for me, and don’t really care what other people are doing. Promoting a feud doesn’t make anyone a better astrologer.
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This reminds of seeing others debate whether Tropical/Sidereal/13 sign Astrology is the ONE TRUE Astrology and give arguments against other systems.
Honestly I think each Astrology system is true within their own framework. Yes, modern Astrology doesn’t use alot of the tools Medieval Astrologers did (alot were lost), but that doesn’t mean it can’t be accurate. Even some Traditional Astrologers have incorporated Uranus, Neptune, and Pluto into their readings.
I am a beginner as well and I just recommend sticking to 1 system for now and gaining as much knowledge as you can before comparing the other systems.
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I personally feel the effects of Uranus and Neptune in my life, so I strongly disagree with anyone who says they’re fake.
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Modern astrology is often conflated with pop astrology. There are, unfortunately, quite a few traditional astrologers with superiority complexes, of which you’ll find quite a few on this subreddit as well. What is important to remember is that tradition is just aged heresy – modern astrology has a lot of clutter because it has not yet been refined and the ‘correct’ techniques from it have not yet been selected, but every tradition touted as truth was just as controversial when it was first developed.
Ultimately, astrology is a spiritual path. There are no correct spiritual paths.
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it’s not really a question of true or false, both of these approaches have merit
personally though i think anyone who disavows the outer planets is crazy
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If you are onto finding some truth…
– The inner planets holds a lot of the drama we play out in life wether you look ta the outer planets or not.
– Aspect patterns stay the same and holds lots of keys to interpreting astrology.
Dig into the history of house system and what it calculates from to make up your own mind. Or go from experience and find what works best.
Look for patterns in a chart, that tells you a story, the whole explains the chart. Therefore many different systems can result in similar readings.
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Lmao. They are telling their own truth, and basically only their own truths. Maybe they can be yours too, you have to study and find out.
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Who are you hearing this from?
