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Discussion
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Something I’ve noticed a lot of in my readings is a modern tendency to downplay the effects of magick as completely psychological in nature. From shifting goetic demons to mere jungian archetypes, to the HGA being seen as ones higher self, the “cool new thing” in the occult seems to be a desire to demystify the mystical as much as possible.
Personally, that interpretation doesn’t appeal to me, as I find the idea of communicating with other intelligences and connecting with something bigger than me to achieve at least temporary transcendence to be far more exciting than just hallucinating parts of my own brain talking to me or therapy with a few extra bells and whistles. That being said, I would be interested to know when this trend started.
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When did the trend of downplaying the supernatural within magick begin?
updated 1 year, 8 months ago
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It’s just one popular way of looking at things. The idea of magic as pure psychodrama has been around for ages. It’s just a popular school of thought. I see it as a good thing, since there’s so many kids running around on here convincing themselves that they’ve been cursed when really it’s just anxiety and an active imagination. Being able to explain how magic can work psychologically can help them be less freaked out, or encourage them not to rely on magic for literally everything.
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Probably people being attracted to the aesthetic and seeking some kind of divinity that aren’t wholly convinced of things that can’t be empirically proven. I think it’s fine either way as long as you’re not hurting anyone or trying to force your point of view on people.
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I think there’s much more to magic than psychology, but I don’t call it supernatural either, because nothing is above nature. If magic and gods exist, they are natural. Paranormal or metaphysical are more appropriate terms.
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I’ve seen many a post here asking for Witchcraft answers to really non magical problems. Sometimes the correct answer isn’t esoteric.
Many Green and Kitchen witches are using herbalism and botany when practicing, but the methods and rituals/intentions is what makes it special.
Many Witches are atheist, some agnostic, some work with a small group of deities from one pantheon, some to a whole bunch of deities and demons. Some Witches say they are Christian (This is the hardest one to get my head around)
Our practices are quite diverse.
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The nice thing about witchcraft is that it’s something that each person can shape for themself. Each practitioner creates and interprets their practice to best help them achieve their goals and each person follows their own needs, inclinations, and strengths.
Many of us appreciate that there is no “right way” to practice because witchcraft isn’t a religion or a belief, it’s a toolkit to be used to build your own unique experience. No one else’s practice takes anything away from yours. Doing something differently from your peers doesn’t mean anyone is more or less correct. It’s good to make space for diverse experiences and understandings in a generally non-judgmental community because we gain knowledge collectively through diverse approaches.
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It’s been coopted by superficial people who see it as a sort self-help trend. Like yoga, which is similarly white-washed. Also some people seem uncomfortable with the idea of non human entities existing, and that’s easily rationalised away with materialistic thinking.
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That’s from a lack of their own experiences with the craft, there are levels to this
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Honestly, it’s because science can explain more and more witchcraft (placebo effect, the actual medical attributes of herbs, certain supernatural behaviors, brain waves during meditation, sleep paralysis, infeared sound for ghosts, psychology.)
It is also not logical to believe in all supernatural things. Believe all you want but it is fully impossible for a Game of Throne style dragon to appear. So since we are a logic driven species and culture (in the West notably), we don’t automatically believe in supernatural beings. Even when we do, we rarely have concrete proof.
We’ve also seen the horrors of letting superstition win out and people have the duty to ensure what they are going through isn’t a physical or mental illness.
Does that mean witchcraft doesn’t work? Not saying that at all. I just mean that most of it is actually completly normal and most can be explained.
There are fewer and fewer mysteries as magic and the mundane are the same.
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I’m agnostic so I’m willing to concede that it could be purely psychological. I feel in my heart that it’s something other than just confirmation bias, but that’s not really a way to prove anything. So it’s more of a if the only thing it does is psychological, that’s ok. If it is in fact actual magick then that’s heckin cool. I don’t begrudge others for their belief in the mystic unless it’s to the point of absurdity, but I’m autistic and struggle to know context or have situational awareness so even if I think someone is “too woo” I wouldn’t tell them. And anyway, I’m still doing spells and have jars of random shit so who am I to judge?
The autism also means I benefit from the ritualistic behaviors regardless of the mundane or magickal aspect. I don’t think there’s a wrong way to be a witch (aside from being intentionally harmful, of course).
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I think science is important and I think in today’s world more people are embracing science, facts, knowledge. Which is an amazing thing and super important when we still live in a world where people are denying climate change and not respecting science.
We can balance science and witchcraft. Not everything needs a perfect answer but we shouldn’t deny science either.
No matter what spell I cast I’m not going to fly if I jump off a roof. Gravity exists.
I personally am very spiritual but don’t believe in things like ghosts or demons. It doesn’t make sense to me.
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We draw maps of magick works. Both interpretations you mention are maps. A map is never reality, but an abstract description of it. No one is right & everyone is right. Quantum physics describes the same thing as Hinduism. But as you know there are different kind of maps, different ratios, different art styles. 10 people walk 100m and draw 10 different maps of that path. You can‘t put these things in human terms, it‘s not a human concept.
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I am a skeptic through and through. If I don’t see it, I do not believe it. I have found that blind faith is the greatest weakness of mankind, and to put it plainly it has been used throughout the ages to manipulate people.
I don’t see witchcraft any different. I still see people claiming people are cursed, I still see people selling snake oils and claiming they can cure cancer with grapefruit peels. People still venerate Alister Crowley as sage of occult magic, when none of what he did was due to spirits, or gods. He was a cult personality that preyed on people seeking answers.
Historically witchcraft was a combination of theatre, spiritualism, and understanding of things at the time. We called things weird names like eye of newt is just mustard seed. We said don’t blow out candles because blowing out a candle can cause a fire. We offered tips for convincing a baby as best as we could to our knowledge and theory. We used magic to provide comfort and healing, physical and mental, or to harm and harass. Like we all can’t ignore that some hexes are pretty direct in history. This is not to discredit the idea of spirit or mysticism in the craft, but only to show there is logical bend to almost all of it. Logic and faith are at times siblings, and at times enemies. In the case of witchcraft, it’s somewhere in between and the two are linked. Even a skeptic witch like me sees that a ritual invokes faith, and faith invokes emotion and emotion is a catalyst to change. Maybe I don’t believe I have spirits in the room with me whispering in my ear. Maybe someone else does, it doesn’t really matter. What matters is we both get to where we are going in the craft.
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What is HGA lol my gripe is that recently practitioners started using abbreviations for everything.
Though I agree to be honest the whole higher self idea to me seemed, well it never made sense to me
Because it’s supposed to be you at your highest potential… but first off how do you know what that looks like, second that is going to change with every choice you make, third how would they communicate with you unless of course it’s a trickster pretending to be you in the future. I can get into it more but I just woke up
